Sarah Goldberg bids farewell toBarryand Sally Reed after four elastic seasons.
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Spoilers follow for theBarryseries finale, wow.
InBarry,Sally Reed often had to scream to be heard.
But in the series finale, she leaves us with something new: a quiet smile.
The story wraps up where it needs to, Goldberg tells me.
Its difficult when theres a crime story.
You dont want to get to a place where its ridiculous.
You dont want to get stuck in a corner.
I felt like we ended in a really solid place.
One thing Ive been thinking all season is how much of a departureBarryhas taken from its initial conceit.
That was something Bill Hader and Alec Berg were adamant about not doing.
The tone is really elastic throughout the whole show.
Even in the first season when Barry kills Chris, for example.
None of that was played for laughs.
So I knew from season one,Okay, this is a show that can hold a lot.
Then they pushed that boat out further as we went on.
We were all up to the challenge.
From season one, I knew I wanted to go fullA Woman Under the Influence.
How far can we push this character?
I always saw Sally as a broken, damaged soul with huge drive, ambition, and chutzpah.
But these cracks from her past were always leaking through.
That all comes to a head this season.
As actors, I think we were all really grateful forBarrys variation.
It was never boring.
But there was no limit on it.
That was never discussed.
We wanted to go as bleak and dark as we could.
Even though Ellyn Jameson, whos brilliant in that role, is a foot taller than me.
Everyone was laughing so hard at the monitor and I didnt know why.
But theres not a lot of laughs for Sally.
I didnt really get many jokes.
Noho Hank astutely assesses why Sally was drawn to Barry.
I know the promise of safety has been a constant source of importance to Sally.
And then, again, trying to seek him in the finale.
Its not as though she has a friend to call.
All of her bridges have been burned from the past.
Maybe her agent Lindsay wouldve been there for her, or Gene if she tried.
In his convoluted version of love, I suppose; its not real love at all.
But for her, it felt like some kind of security.
She wants to feel safe, but she wants to escape.
Shes always wanted to escape.
Coming to Los Angeles was an escape.
Being an actress was an escape.
Barry is someone who can fulfill this final great escape.
By the end, she has nowhere to go.
We know she cant go to her parents.
We know theres no one in Joplin.
We had these conversations around how much Sally knows at this point, even about Barry.
How much did he hide?
What did you settle on?Theres this tiny thing.
I wanted to throw in saying his name as this tiny thing of Sally knowing who he is.
Theyve never met in the entire series.
In the finale, she admits that shes a bad mother.
Having a child wouldve been Barrys agenda.
I dont think parenthood was something that entered the equation for her.
I think it had been slightly forced on her.
Going back to the role, shes in an abusive relationship again.
A different bang out of abuse, but abuse nonetheless.
She has chosen this path as a last option and its a miserable one.
Shes totally addicted to alcohol at this point.
The fact that she chooses to play a role was really a lovely touch.
She could probably go to work with her own voice and hair and not be recognized.
Or why hasnt she dyed her hair, or shaved her hair off?
Even within Sally, shes slowed down.
Shes somebody whos historically a fast talker and verbose character, and suddenly everything is semi-monosyllabic.
Shes slowed down her internal rhythm as well.
The last little piece of living shes doing is playing Emily.
Its the last thing giving her any oxygen.
Shes not getting anything out of parenthood.
The rejection of the son is also a rejection of Barry and this lie theyre living.
The one thing Sally has never been is a hypocrite.
She says things as she sees them and feels them.
Thats gotten her in a lot of trouble in the past and made her an asshole at times.
But shes not a calculated person.
She says what she means and follows through on what she intends to do.
Barry is living a totally hypocritical life, pretending to be somebody good, decent, and God-fearing.
She knows its a pile of bullshit.
How can she know how to love this child?
She comes from a loveless family.
Shes in a loveless, fake marriage.
She doesnt love herself.
Where was the language going to develop to become a good parent?
John is a living manifestation of the biggest mistakes shes ever made in her life.
Its impossible not to reject him.
How did you two approach that mother-son moment of reckoning before the shoot-out?He did so well.
Thats the tone on theBarryset, anyway.
We tend to keep things buoyant.
There was no way to go method or sustain Emily off-screen.
It was a relief to have a kid around for it all, because theyre naturally so present.
You suddenly feel a bit of responsibility for setting a good example when theres a kid on set.
I think we all did.
We were all trying to keep things joyful for him.
For that final scene, we got to such a place of trust inBarryas an ensemble.
Everybody is so relaxed.
I almost had to not think about it ahead of time to not put pressure on it.
Its the only moment everything is dropped because she thinks shes going to die.
Theres no point in lying anymore.
Most of what shes saying is an in-the-moment realization.
That was another reason not to prepare for it.
I mean, I looked at the script and learned the lines.
Im someone who loves rehearsal, but this needed something else.
When she says shes not a good person, she means it, and she only realizes it then.
Shes looking at this kid like, Youve come from all this ugliness.
Youve come from a serial killer and a broken person and youre actually all right.
How the hell did that happen?
All those things are happening at once.
How do you envision Sallys life in those in-between years before we see her again as a theater teacher?
I talked to Bill about it.
We came up with this idea that shedidtry.
She tried to say something, but nobody would take her seriously or believe it.
That was one option.
Another option is shes choosing her son.
Those were two paths we talked about.
Ultimately, I imagined life became a lot quieter for her, in a nice way.
Shes a mix of all things and thats what made her such a joy to play.
Shes not rich and famous, but shes getting to do what she loves and thats actually enough.
I love that theres this simplicity and purity of passion, I thought that was so lovely.
She still needs the validation.
She needs that external validation, even in this small-town high-school production ofOur Town.
I thought it was a poetic end for our gal Sal.
I was wondering, Am I going to get a dramatic death?
Am I going to kill Barry?
And it was such a simple end.
I was moved by it.
We did her right.
Sallys final scene is in her car, driving alone, and admiring her bouquet of flowers.
She struck me as being content.
What was the direction you were given there?
Bill used the word content to me.
I thought, Good for you, Sally.
Then in the car, we actually pared it down even further.
We went even simpler with it.
Its not an Oscar in the chair next to her.
Its a bouquet of drugstore flowers at best.
Maybe supermarket flowers if the students splurged.
Its such a simple thing, but she is fulfilled.
That wasnt the last thing I shot.
The last thing I shot was that penultimate scene in the snow.
But this was one of my last days, and we knew it would be my finalBarryscene.
For all of our final shots, there was a kind of quiet that took over.
It was just a soft, calm, and quiet day on set.
The direction was really just contentment and enjoying this quiet ride alone home.
I cant believe she almost has a happy ending.
I mean, shes giving her kid vodka.
She needed to rise to the occasion.
That boy didnt choose to exist and now hes left without a dad.
I think she steps into the role of a good enough mother.
Weve got that final scene and he says, I love you.
And her response is, Was my show good?
Instead of, I love you, too.
A true wrong place, wrong time situation.
She killed him in self-defense.
But in that moment, shes lost all sense of reality and shes in a pure animal state.
All the rage in her life is coming out at once and shes in fear.
I would leave that one up to the audience to decide if she redeemed herself for that murder.
And she was pretty horrible to some of her peers, particularly Natalie.
I hope somewhere in the second time jump she wrote Natalie an apology card.
I dont know if she did, but we can dream for her.
Its the least she could do.
Im curious how you interpreted it.
Does he believe what hes seeing?
Hes potentially willing to choose the lie.
Hell remember that and it plays so differently to what actually happened.
His father was not this big hero on that day.
Its a beautiful, subtle performance.
First of all, she never let her son watch the movie.
Thats why hes having to sneak away to a sleepover to see it.
But secondly, I dont think thats something she would encourage in the household.
Shes not letting Barry live on a heroic pedestal.
If anything, shes avoiding it all.
She told him the truth as a child.
I dont think theres an open discussion between them, but theres not a sugarcoated version, either.
She really cut him out of their lives.
I dont think theres a photo of Barry in the house.
